PolyMVA Website – Encouraging Patients to Ignore their Oncologist

September 23, 2008 at 4:12 pm (Bad Science, Dangerously Wrong, Remedies, Supplements) (, , , , , , , , , , )

The PolyMVA survivors website is advising cancer patients to ignore their oncologist, to refuse chemotherapy and/or radiotherapy and to choose an alternative cancer treatment instead. I do hope this PolyMVA group are basing their approach on the best possible evidence. Let’s see… Apparently, “POLY MVA has been scientifically designed to CORRECT DNA BREAKDOWNS and return the damaged cell to normal cellular function”. Oh good – at least it’s been scientifically designed. Designed by whom though? “This product was developed by Dr. Merrill Garnett, a highly regarded biochemist, who has been conducting research since 1959 with the objective of creating an electronic frequency specificity to restore the DNA exchange energy pathway”. Excellent. Who is Merrill Garnett? “Dr. Garnett is a former naval dentist who took up medical research in 1959″. And what, precisely, is a ‘DNA exchange energy pathway’? Well, it is something that gives you two hits on google* – one is the PolyMVA survivors website and one is a PDF written by someone called Joe Demers who “would like to share with you an alternative cancer treatment protocol”. In other words, the phrase has been made up by the inventor of a dietary supplement. It is, in all probability, complete bollocks – designed to give the appearance of scienciness and to baffle the layperson.

There is a section of this page: cancer decisions, that looks at the evidence for PolyMVA and is titled “Where’s the Proof?” – the evidence is very thin indeed. Quite apart from the fact that what evidence is available is being misrepresented by the PolyMVA survivors site. A talk at a symposium is described as a “clinical study” by the PolyMVA survivors site and they rely heavily on animal data – from a study that they fail to cite, with a nameless author, that does not appear in any Pubmed-indexed journal (nor does it appear anywhere else, except for this single webpage – according to the author of the cancer decisions site).

It strikes me that the PolyMVA website is run along the same lines as Matthias Rath’s South African AIDS business.

————————————————————————————————————

A bit more linkage: polymvasurvivors - PDF’d for posterity, because this is the bit that most pissed me off. Website: http://www.polymvasurvivors.com/. More on Poly MVA from the American Cancer Society. My dodgy-supplements-for-serious-diseases post; the original cancer drugs post. The online reporting form that I am (over-)using to take on PolyMVA.

*Very nearly a googlewhack - 2 hits for bullshitting about DNA energy.

Edited to Add: Google’s motto is “Don’t be Evil” but they seem to be having trouble living up to that ideal. Jon at Holford Watch has posted on Cancer Quackery in Google ads.

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58 Comments

  1. jdc325 said,

    Google’s motto is “Don’t be Evil” but they seem to be having trouble living up to that ideal. Jon at Holford Watch has posted on Cancer Quackery in Google ads here.

  2. jdc325 said,

    They’re here too. Seemingly concentrating their efforts on advertising PolyMVA for prostate cancer and pets.

    Prostate cancer.
    Blogging on cancer – page four of seven is here.
    Pets.
    Cost = $150 per 8 ounce bottle and a bottle lasts from six days to “over six months” – depending on what you are using it for. $150 for six days’ supply of an unproven remedy seems a little steep to me, but apparently it’s all because of the price of palladium.
    FAQ.

  3. Deb O. said,

    How much time have you spent INTERVIEWING the people who REVERSED their cancer with Poly MVA??…the survivor site has phone numbers, emails etc….I am sure they would be happy to be interviewed in person even….and at that point you would be able to see their medical records, blood markers etc. first hand…You definitely sound like somebody who is “talking through your hat”….As they say “there is no excuse for ignorance”…go to the site and start interviewing….and after that, write a book about how POLY MVA does nothing…I seriously challenge you to go to the SOURCE OF THE TRUTH…..

  4. jdc325 said,

    It just goes to show you can’t be too careful.

    I’m not sure how my collecting anecdotes would be helpful. If Poly MVA is a cure for cancer then it should be tested. If it is shown by properly designed tests to work then it should be provided by medical professionals as and when it is appropriate for them to do so.

    By the way, do you have any comment on the way that those promoting Poly MVA use what little evidence currently exists? [A talk at a symposium is described as a “clinical study” by the PolyMVA survivors site and they rely heavily on animal data - from a study that they fail to cite, with a nameless author, that does not appear in any Pubmed-indexed journal.]

  5. Deb O. said,

    You need to do more web search…there are doctors already using this product and they bublish the results…Like I say, you are talking through your hat!!..Poly MVA has a product that is being patented….which means, oncologists will soon be ALLOWED by the FDA to use it for a cancer therapy…In the meantime OTC Poly is available as a supplement…(How come you do not know that?)..Poly MVA is concentrated, bio-available nutrition…the MVA stands for MINERALS…VITAMINS AND AMINO ACIDS…The first thing you should understand is that Poly makes a big difference…The first rule of Medicine is “DO NO HARM!” which Minerals, vitamins and amino acids don’t!…Poly and other complimentary supplements provide NUTRITION which assists the body in making healthy blood cells which in turn strengthens the immune system which then protects chemo/radiation patients from infections..NO place on the site does it say that this company ecourages people to ignore their oncologist ..as a matter of fact, they work WITH oncologists!…How come you did not mention that?…However, many people quit chemo and radiation and just use the POLY..They have their own reasons for doing so..Some are told to ,basically, GO HOME AND DIE because, the treatments were not working and for many, they would likely die of a virus, pneumonia etc BECAUSE they were NOT making enough blood cells to RESIST INFECTION…The biggest point that you are missing is that WHEN the body has EVERYTHING it NEEDS, it will HEAL itself and that is the purpose of good sound nutrition…and that in turn is WHY the people who testify on the survivor site keep saying “Poly MVA cured my cancer”….technically it did not, it provided the body with necessary nutrition so that the BODY COULD HEAL ITSELF….Nobody is asking you to collect anecdotes, I merely asked you to talk to the people who have used the Poly and verify that their cancer disappeared..They have medical records for that you know….If you care about truth, write and or talk to the survivors..I think you are just unable to admit that you may have a misconception of the Poly….when it is your turn and it is YOUR LIFE, you will be more open minded and willing to talk to the people who had awsome success with nutrional therapy… (chances are getting close to 50/50 chance that YOU will have cancer) think about that…Have a consious and stop putting this product down….As far as studies go…WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN?????….Alot of cancer patients who use Poly MVA are part of an ongoing study…when they sign up for the study, they are able to buy the product for less money…..DO YOU HOMEWORK GUY!!…Your words in your blog may have cost somebodys life, just because they took YOUR word for it..talk to the people who SWEAR that their cancers were reversed..What better HUMAN STUDY exists for any product than the RESULTS AND MEDICAL REPORTS OF THE PEOPLE WHO USED IT WITH SUCCESS???..I hope whoever reads this will make a decision based on the the truth you acquire from the SURVIVORS who are ready and willing to talk to you..I know one of these cancer survivors personally…She was told that her cancer was too advanced,and that she would likely not live but a few weeks…So she tried Poly mVA and she is now cancer free after almost 5 years….http://www.polymvasurvivors.com/testimonials.html….This is a link to human study..One based on people not animals..http://www.polymva.com/pdf/LIEBERMAN-TOWNSENDARTICLE6-06.pdf..the next link has 19 different links on published articles/studies/abstracts..at the bottom of each page is MORE supporting data listed that is not related to the Poly MVA sit….http://www.polymvasurvivors.com/scientific_research.html..Go to the site and check it out…As for your comment and I quote…”Poly MVA use what little evidence currently exists? [A talk at a symposium is described as a “clinical study” by the PolyMVA survivors site and they rely heavily on animal data - from a study that they fail to cite, with a nameless author, that does not appear in any Pubmed-indexed journal.]“..I am wondering IF you can direct me to ANY medical studies on drugs that DID NOT begin with trial on ANIMALS??…For myself, I would hesitate to use cancer causing chemical and cancer causing radiation to cure cancer, I just cannot get that to make sense!!…so using that same scenario, If I should somehow get poisoned, I could take another poison and that would cure me of the first poison??….Thanks

  6. How to Get Six Pack Fast said,

    I noticed that this is not the first time you write about this topic. Why have you chosen it again?

  7. Deb O. said,

    Lets see….the subject for this blog is “PolyMVA Website – Encouraging Patients to Ignore their Oncologist”….I would like people to find their own truth with an open mind rather than make a clouded decision by the opinions of jdc325…Hopefully that answers the quetion…

  8. jdc325 said,

    “You need to do more web search…there are doctors already using this product and they bublish the results”
    As anecedata? Or as data from properly controlled trials?

    “Poly MVA has a product that is being patented….which means, oncologists will soon be ALLOWED by the FDA to use it for a cancer therapy”
    Really? So they’ve done the properly controlled trials then? Can we see the methods and results of these trials?

    “The first thing you should understand is that Poly makes a big difference…The first rule of Medicine is “DO NO HARM!” which Minerals, vitamins and amino acids don’t!…”
    The potential adverse effects of vitamins, minerals and amino acids are well known. I note that the mineral is palladium, which is not necessary for human health.

    “Poly and other complimentary supplements provide NUTRITION”
    Not really true, given that palladium is not necessary for human health.

    “NO place on the site does it say that this company ecourages people to ignore their oncologist ..as a matter of fact, they work WITH oncologists!…How come you did not mention that?”
    Bullshit. I shall now quote directly from the PDF I linked to in my blog post:

    Before you can make the very difficult decision to choose an Alternative Cancer Treatment and ignore the wishes of your Oncologist, you need to know why you SHOULD NOT choose Chemotherapy & radiation.

    Try reading blog posts and the linked sites before you try to deny that a website has given particular advice.

    “WHEN the body has EVERYTHING it NEEDS, it will HEAL itself”
    Excellent. An example of the WTF fallacy. Linky.

    “Nobody is asking you to collect anecdotes, I merely asked you to talk to the people who have used the Poly and verify that their cancer disappeared”
    Um, do you know what an anecdote is?

    “when it is your turn and it is YOUR LIFE, you will be more open minded and willing to talk to the people who had awsome success with nutrional therapy…”
    Ah, the “open-minded” gambit. You may find this video interesting. Despite your confidence in your own predictions, I have to tell you that it is unlikely that I would choose unevidenced treatments if I were seriously ill. I prefer my medicine evidence-based, thank you.

    “What better HUMAN STUDY exists for any product than the RESULTS AND MEDICAL REPORTS OF THE PEOPLE WHO USED IT WITH SUCCESS???”
    An RCT.

    I note that rather than answer my question about the way the website presents the evidence, you have posed an irrelevant question of your own. Of course animal data is usually a starting point. But it should not be assumed that what works in animals works in humans. This is why (as a society) we conduct human trials too. And we use controls and blinding to try to eliminate bias as far as possible. This is why I keep referring to properly conducted trials.

  9. Deb O. said,

    My gosh you are out there…This product will be brought before the FDA…not that the FDA necessarily cares about what is actually good for human consumption…BUT FDA standards require the makers to jump through the hoops…So if it measures up to the FDA it will be approved as a cancer therapy, will it not?…In which case, it will blow your research on this product out of the water…your link to video…sheesh!…what a joke….WHERE are your concrete links?….anybody can do U Tube…

    ADMIN EDIT:
    “So if it measures up to the FDA it will be approved as a cancer therapy, will it not?…In which case, it will blow your research on this product out of the water..” If it’s properly tested and found to work then I will have no problem with its use as a cancer therapy. Has it been properly tested and found to work? Or are we playing the “what if” game?
    “your link to video…sheesh!…what a joke….WHERE are your concrete links?….anybody can do U Tube…” The video link was a specific response to your appeal for open-mindedness on my part. I fail to see how anyone could have assumed that it was supposed to be concrete evidence of anything.

    I can only assume that you are deliberately trolling.

  10. Deb O. said,

    Honestly, I just want you back off and NOT discourage the people who are looking for hope..People need to take charge of their own cancer treatment decisions…poly is an option…in response to your question/comment…”If it’s properly tested and found to work then I will have no problem with its use as a cancer therapy. Has it been properly tested and found to work? Or are we playing the “what if” game?”…ummmm, hellooo…The people who have and are using just the OTC version of Poly have documented medical testing, that they have beat the averages while taking chemo radiation and poly or whether even the poly alone..Your little video kept stating “examine the evidence” because CRITICAL THINKING is a doorway to being open minded…The goal of this therapy is to INSURE that all NEWLY developing tissue/blood cells will be left unharmed during cancer treatment..Hence, preventing the patient from DYING of secondary infections and SECONDARY CANCERS which are indeed caused by traditional cancer therapies..I should think that EVERYBODY would be jumping up and down that there MAY be even a REMOTE possiblity that a healthy cancer treatment is in the works!!…Yes, I agree it is expensive and so is the RESEARCH/patents/hoops presented by the FDA…The cost however, is not even close to the cost of chemo/radiation treatments which runs into MILLIONS for just one cancer patient…BUT people can obviously afford it as it is indeed selling…and after being in contact with the patients who have used it, hearing their story first hand, seeing their med records/blood counts and final CLEAN BILL OF HEALTH even years after, I gotta say…Poly doesn’t scare me even a little…This will be my last post jdc, I have alot of people depending on me!..Best I get back on task and quit wasting my time…Take care!..I wish you LOTS OF GOOD HEALTH because everybody deserves a LIFETIME!

    ADMIN EDIT: “…ummmm, hellooo…The people who have and are using just the OTC version of Poly have documented medical testing”
    If you have a link to peer-reviewed, publicly published research documenting that Poly MVA works then feel free to post that link here.

    “The goal of this therapy is to INSURE that all NEWLY developing tissue/blood cells will be left unharmed during cancer treatment..”
    And does it achieve this goal? Has this been documented? Where is the reliable evidence that this is the case? You have yet to link to any evidence at all regarding Poly MVA.

  11. survivor7554 said,

    wow! I had no trouble finding the links in this blog and have read the survivor testimonials. Have already received response. Personally, I feel I could read scientific data and still not know if it actually worked for somebody. I would rather get the information from somebody who could tell me first hand how it worked and what the results were over time. I am shocked that you do not consider the cancer survivors testimony “evidence”. The fact exists that many many people are swearing by this product and wish to help other victims find an extended life. In my mind, that means alot! The contact has shared the test results and even offered to scan and email their blood work and physician notes. I am still contacting more people from the site so I can make an informed decision. I am glad I ran into your blog. Thanks for leading me to the Poly MVA site!

  12. jdc325 said,

    “I am shocked that you do not consider the cancer survivors testimony “evidence”.”
    I do consider it to be evidence – it is anecdotal evidence (which is notoriously unreliable).

    “The fact exists that many many people are swearing by this product and wish to help other victims find an extended life.”
    Many people will swear that all manner of things are true. Here’s just one example of something that has a fair number of supporters: The Flat Earth Society (“Deprogramming the masses since 1547, the Flat Earth Society has long been dedicated to the Flat Earth principles which define our organization”). Relying on the fact that many people swear by something is not always a great idea. You may like to try reading Nizkor.
    Here’s an example that Nizkor uses: “Jill and Jane have some concerns that the rules their sorority has set are racist in character. Since Jill is a decent person, she brings her concerns up in the next meeting. The president of the sorority assures her that there is nothing wrong with the rules, since the majority of the sisters like them.” (I’ve seen a similar question posed elsewhere: if a majority of voters in a US state support slavery, does that make slavery right?)

    “Personally, I feel I could read scientific data and still not know if it actually worked for somebody.”
    Not sure what your point is here. If it is that scientific evidence is too hard to understand then you may be underestimating yourself – or overestimating how difficult it is to understand scientific evidence if you are sufficiently motivated.

    “I would rather get the information from somebody who could tell me first hand how it worked and what the results were over time.”
    Well, I could tell you all sorts of things first-hand – but how would you know if my first-hand evidence was reliable? If I had been subject to cognitive bias, then my first-hand evidence would be skewed. This is why scientists conduct double-blind placebo-controlled trials on drugs – to try to minimise or eliminate bias.

    “I had no trouble finding the links in this blog”
    Excellent – perhaps you would like to comment on the PDF link where the website I am writing about tells people to ignore their oncologist and why they “SHOULD NOT choose Chemotherapy & Radiation”? (Bizarrely, Deb O claimed this encouragement to ignore ones oncologist and refuse chemo and radiation did not exist.)

    By the way, do you have any comment on the way that those promoting Poly MVA use what little evidence currently exists? I asked Deb O about this, but she failed to give an opinion.

    “I am glad I ran into your blog. Thanks for leading me to the Poly MVA site!”
    Forgive me for doubting that you found the Poly MVA site via my blog, but I find that assertion surprising indeed. From your comments here and your chosen username, you sound like a true believer.

  13. Constantina said,

    I just went through your conversation and all I can say is that there might not be proven trials that polymva works but for the rest of the chemotherapy drugs there are trials and a loot of scary evidence that they do not work! You dont need a lot of words to understand that, if you had cnacer and the doctor said try this drug and you will have a dozen of freaking side effects destrying your body with a 3% of success, what does this translate to you??? To me it translated like ‘we have proven this shit doesn’t work’ so please let people hope and spent their money and life on whatever they want, anyway they don’t buy drugs on polymva they buy hope in bottles

  14. jdc325 said,

    Please can you tell me where the 3% chance of success figure comes from?

    I’ve checked on the websites for the Office for National Statistics and for Cancer Research UK and I can’t find figures to back up your 3% claim.

    Cancer Research UK.

    ONS.

  15. Constantina said,

    check for kidney cancer then

    Admin edit: That’s interesting – your earlier comment seemed to refer to all cancers. Are you changing your claim to refer specifically to kidney cancer? Looking at the ONS stats on kidney cancer, it seems that the 5-year survival rate is 40-45%. The Cancer Research UK site gives one-year survival rates for kidney cancer, which have improved from around 45% in the 1970s to 65-68% in the period covering 2000/01. Are you sure you meant kidney cancer?

    You seem not to have read the information available via my links and you have not told me where the 3% figure comes from. I’m genuinely interested in the source for this figure and would be grateful if you could supply it.

  16. Constantina said,

    And please all of you, this is such a sensitive matter, you should not take it that personally especially if it doesn’t affect you in person. ANd let’s say you are found with a malignant fast spreading desease and doctros give you their scientifically proven drugs and you go through all the hell no matter what , keeping faithfully to your doctors suggestions, and there comes the day that you go back to find out that those drugs managed nothing at all, what are you going to do?? Sit and wait the day to die because nothing else is scientificalle proven????? Trust me, You’ll try things even if in a corner of your head a voice tells you that people take advantage of you, but even with the’scientifically proven drugs’ people and pharmacetical companies giants like wolves take advantage of you, it is in noones interest that you live on nodrugs, no one is interested in curing you but just in taking you money

  17. jdc325 said,

    “it is in noones interest that you live on nodrugs, no one is interested in curing you but just in taking you money”
    That is something I believe to be not simply untrue, but also offensive to those working in the fields of cancer research and patient care.

  18. Constantina said,

    It is offensive and I hope someone would start taking it seriously! You believe it is untrue, you dont know that it is! Even if it is untrue, my opinio is that they should start working better and finding things that really work because all i can hear is words and promises but no actions or proofs , in my family there is not a single person who has been cured of cancer, and we have quite a lot of insetences, so please ,I am living it, you are just reading it

    Admin: you don’t seem to know whether your claim is true or false and you don’t seem to care. This is the hallmark of a bullshitter. [See
    Frankfurt.]

  19. Deb O. said,

    Just thought I would present some “evidence” which I witnessed for myself, with a human who used Poly in the final stages of bone cancer,which is WHERE BLOOD CELLS ARE MADE..My best friend was diagnosed just 2 months ago as being in the final stages of bone cancer…She had pain in her leg and it was her only symptom, unfortunately, her cancer was advanced…Once she had the proper pain management she felt great…she was told she would likely live up to a year without treatment and hopefully up to 5 years WITH treatment…The day after her FIRST radiation treatment, she was sick,…pneumonia alreadly…She was treated for the pneumonia and unable to have radiation for another week, when her bloodwork improved…she had radiation twice more, she became sick again…Again the wait for her blood work to improve…then radiation again for several days then blood work was poor and again the long wait..This scenario continued..I went to visit her on the afternoon of April 14th, she said to me “I am full of shit! Like you didn’t know that!” and then she laughed…She was in good spirits but complained of a tummy ache which had been diagnosed as severe constipation due to morphine..She was in good spirits looking forward to her dose of Milk of Mag..The next morning, on April 15 she was scheduled for radiation and chemo…On the morning of April 15th she was found UNRESPONSIVE and the family was called in and she was placed in Hospice, they said she had only a few hours to live, a couple days at most…Turns out she had MORE than just constipation..She had a HUGE abcess in her colon which was leaking infection into her abdomin..The doctors explained that Morphine had caused the constipation and radiation had killed her white cells hence, an infection had started and her immune system could not fight the infection due to the lack of cells..They explained to the family that they did not expect she would ever wake up from her coma and would die in a few hours..The family was told that they could fly her too Minneapolis for surgery to “clean up” her colon but her chances were very slim of surviving the surgery..Based on what the doctor said the family opted not to attempt the surgery and let nature take its course and try keep her comfortable..BUT then she WOKE UP that same night and when her children gave her the report she said “I am not dying at least not yet” and stated that she did have alot of pain in her abdomen and back and so began a series of increased doseages of morphine which of course would ADD to the CONSTIPATION ..She was hungry and thirsty but received only sips of water and sips of clear fluids and occasional bites of jello due to the perforation..She remained alert with long intervals of sleep due to the morphine but was easily awakened when moved or talked to..Doctors had determined her kidneys were shutting down, her liver was in bad shape also and her blood testing showed poor blood cell production..She was NOT ALLOWED food due to the colon perforation so her body had NOTHING WITH WHICH TO MAKE NEW BLOOD CELLS or energy for that matter..I bought the Poly MVA, gave it to her children and she took 6 tsp the first day..Her daughters did not tell dorctors and nurses that they were giving her Poly…By that evening she was sitting up in bed, talking and laughing and stated she felt much better!..The next morning her blood work was MUCH improved and the medical staff was AMAZED AND CHEERING but confused by the improvement and stated “I have not seen blood work like this from anybody in your moms condition..typically, it just becomes increasingly worse!”..Now the nurses are telling her that she is their “miracle lady”..She continued to take the poly and by the end of her first week in hospice her test results continued to improve everyday..Kidneys much improved, liver function much improved, she was able to have a BM for the first time in over a week and she was making blood cells like crazy..At this time doctors determined that the colon perforation must have healed because she was now able to pass gas, which could not happen if it was still perforated..They were impressed but stated that she was “still not out of the woods”..Then she had two bad days of heart burn and nausea and her kids were afraid to give her the poly for fear she would vomit and aspirate in her sleep..On the morning of the third day she had such horrific pain that the morphine was increased to a point that she only woke up when moved..At this time, she was unable to wake up to take the Poly..Blood work, body funtions all took a dive and the very best friend I had in this world passed away..She was a whopping 62 years old…All I have to say is that I wish she had gotten the Poly MVA before she had radiation..It very likely would have kept her body making blood cells and that means this SCENARIO might have been prevented.. because she would have had A STRENGTHENED IMMUNE SYSTEM JUST LIKE YOU READ ABOUT IN THE Poly MVAA SURVIVORS TESTIMONIES..And so this turned out the SAME WAY it does for SOO many GOOD PEOPLE..My friend DID NOT DIE OF CANCER..My best friend died of THE EFFECTS OF RADIATION..As hind sight is 20/20, chances are she would still be here if she had done NOTHING.. But she FOLLOWED THE RECOMENDATIONS OF HER DOCTOR AND ONCOLOGIST..Her family and I are grateful to Poly MVA for giving her another 16 days of life and a better quality of life when doctors said she had “a few hours/a couple days at most to live”..In a nutshell, the Poly increased blood cell production, strengthened her immune system, improved kidney and liver function, improved mental clarity and provided an overall feeling of wellbeing and provided energy which gave my friend a prolonged and better quality of life in her final days..NOW the family has told the medical staff and countless others about what they witnessed with POLY MVA and NOW we have a small army of believers/promoters in our little corner of the world!..Our only regret is that she did not get it sooner..

  20. Constantina said,

    Thanks for the hope you just passed to me , I am so sorry for your friend..:(

  21. Deb O. said,

    Thank you Constantina..We will bury her tomorrow..Do not be afraid of the POLY..Make contact with with AMARC and with the people on the survivors site, they will be a great source of information and support for you..AMARC has some financial groups that provide donations if you have trouble paying for the Poly..If there is anything I can do please send me your email and I will contact you offline and give you contact info for an AWSOME SURVIVOR AND POLY USER..Hang in girl..

  22. Constantina said,

    Thanks you so much for all your kind help an support,I lost on monday my beloved aunt from bone cancer of unknown source, I am familiar with the pain, but hang on and be brave.. I would really like to have information from you but I really don’t know how to give you my email address with out exposing it to everyone

  23. Constantina said,

    As a simple answer to the admin
    My oncologist provided me with the rates I have just stated above, I am a 5-year survivor but that is completely on nodrugs, the cut and wait option as doctors like to call it, most of kidney cancer cases do not metastasize or even reoccur that is the reason why doctors sit back and wait, well I was like for five years as well, but on the sixth year I had reoccurence and know I have metastases tot he liver, I visited one of the best hospitals in england The Royal Mrsden Hospital in London, and claimed opinion of one of the best oncologist on the subject which I dont know If I should name, and all he said is that my desease is not curable and all they can do is administer me a drug for some time as to give me a few more months of life, I dont know where online I can give you the results because my information is taken from the best of the professional on kidney cancer. Also, 3% is for poor prognosis metastasized patients in which I belong, I AM NOT TALKING BULLSHIT, SORRY

  24. Panayiota said,

    The only thing I would like to emphasise or critisise on this discussion, is that, I know you are an atheist( to jdc325) but you should really be more kind to the feelings of the others. Especially people that suffer something that you couldn’t even imagine how it feels. At the point near death, all it really matters is not drugs and percentages, and homeopathy and everything, but just some amount of hope, hope to live because you have the right to. And you have the right to do whatever you can to live. Those critisising this (like your self) should really think more in a 360 view, be kinder to the feelings of the others, and think for once ‘I might me wrong!’

  25. Deb O. said,

    Hi Constantina..I have created a temporary account for you to contact me at..You can write me at it and I will answer and you will not have to post it here..the new email is
    funzy12@gmail.com
    I pray that you find the miracle that so many have..there is no guarantee but a definite hope..I will wait for your email…

  26. Constantina said,

    Thank you so much Deb O. I will contact you as soon as possible

  27. jdc325 said,

    Panayiota, I’ve had a stream of incoherent posts on this thread from people making claims that they refuse to back up. None of them have engaged with the substance of my post, none of them have answered the questions I’ve put to them and some of their claims are, frankly, offensive bullshit (e.g., “it is in noones interest that you live on nodrugs, no one is interested in curing you but just in taking you money”). I can’t see what is so unkind about pointing out the offensive bullshit that is written on a blog. I find it strange that you are focussing on parts of my comments that you perceive as being unkind – and stranger still that you refer to my being an atheist. If your assumption is that atheists are unkind and unfeeling, then you may find that it is a mistaken assumption. I find humanists, for example, to be warm and compassionate people. Your other point seems to be that I am closed-minded and dogmatic, and that this means I am unable to admit that I might be wrong. I can assure you that nothing is further from the truth. I am perfectly happy to be proved wrong and if you feel that any part of any blog post on this website is inaccurate, misleading, or distorted then I will happily look into your complaint. Any inaccurate, misleading, or distorted information will be corrected – and the correction will be given due prominence.

    Thanks for dropping by.

  28. Constantina said,

    Jdc325,
    Thank you for giving me the chance to talk about such matters, I wish everything was as easy as it is in words but in actions things are quite strange, I have given answers, and if you require more information let me know and I will even scan if you want and send you information, I f you have library access then please, access medical records and try to give a go on Liver cancer brain cancer and renal cell carcinoma , try and find trials on metastatic patients, and then tell me of the bullshit I talk about..I wish you were right and that all that pharmaceutical companies cared about was people’s health and well being.. If it never happened to you to loose 3 loved ones in a year and wait for your turn as well because doctors have nothing better to give you then it is not my fault that you are trying to convinve anyone that your claims are right.. Another thing, I never claimed myself that polymva wokrs , I haven’t even calimed to be pro polymva, but I am defenetely telling you this , if it happens to you thing twice

  29. jdc325 said,

    EDIT 7/7/09: Text from comment on another post copied here:

    jdc, I’ve attempted to post the following comment to your PolyMVA thread, but it keeps saying “discarded”. I hope you will move this there:

    Thank you for writing about this PolyMVA ripoff. I have had my own run-in with these PolyMVA snake oil pushers here:
    http://www.ratemds.com/social/?q=node/32285

    Like you, I have also reported them to the FDA. Hopefully, the wrath of the government will eventually befall them all in the guise of an early-morning FBI raid.

  30. Eve Newsom said,

    I pray you never get CANCER….. then, and only then will you know the Truth.

    Why are so many People concerned with the CANCER Patient’s options & choices?

    Leave us alone to choose the paths leading to our Healing!

    There’s OBVIOUSLY no Money in the ‘well’ Industry.. only in the ‘sick’ Industry… therefore, the INSTITUTIONS that profit ONLY from the sick are going to do their best to discredit the Products that actually work for Cancer patients. It’s OK to charge astronomical amounts for Chemotherapy & radiation (which have been PROVEN not to cure Cancer, and in fact CAUSE Cancer!) but it’s not OK for the Distributors of Poly MVA to charge $150.00 per bottle if the need to.

    Get a LIFE… and leave us alone!

  31. jdc325 said,

    “Why are so many People concerned with the CANCER Patient’s options & choices?

    Leave us alone to choose the paths leading to our Healing!”

    Eve – I’m concerned with the behaviour of pill pushers making a profit from their “supplements” by promoting them for treatment of cancer without good evidence of benefit. I’m also concerned with their decision to urge cancer patients to ignore their oncologist. I am not arguing that cancer patients should not have “options & choices” – just that their consent to treatments offered should be informed. I do “leave cancer patients alone” – I have not sought out a single patient to harass them, what I have done is to write about the behaviour of a company selling pills and to respond to comments left by people who have read my thoughts on the behaviour of this firm.

  32. Kimo said,

    What concerns me most about the exchanges taking place here isn’t the science or lack thereof. It’s the incivility of the participants. I think we’re all concerned with getting the best care for cancer patients, we just have different approaches. Insulting others only leads to each party taking harder stances to defend themselves. There is a lot of good information for both sides here which is of great input. However, it would be much easier to wean the relevant and valuable details out of it if we didn’t have to read around the personal attacks. I’m just sayin’…

  33. Brandon Stewart said,

    I was diagnosed with ewings sarcoma in late 2008, had seventeen cycles of chemotherapy followed by 6 weeks of radiation to both arms… not to mension surgery to remove mets off the bottom lobe of my right lung. I had got to the point where surgery was the next step…. I had started taking poly 6 months before the surgeries where mentioned to take bones out and amputate… I had a meeting with the oncologist with my mom beside me and refused surgery… it has been 11 months since my decision, and feeling great!! there is hope with this product… if it wasnt for this product, i’d be a gonner

  34. Greg S. said,

    A lot of opinion here but no hard science.

  35. Fabio said,

    Hello Everybody , i’m writing from Italy and i just bought 3 Poly-MVA bottles for my mother with a brain tumor (GBM). I’m reading over internet before start to give it to her.

    During these 7 months i read a huge quantity of documents,researchs,talked with a lot of oncologist… every time i got a little piece… and now i’m ready to put togheter all the pieces and find a conclusion.

    And the conclusion is that the Pharma industry doesn’t want to cure people : these are the main reason :

    A- no one explained me why a chemioterapeutic drug have to cost so much : for example : a box of 5 pills of temodal (for brain tumor) costs 1.800 Euro!! so each Pill costs 360 Euro!! Also a children could understand that this price is extremely eccessive

    B- A new drug has to pass the Threephases clinical trial to be put in the market…but the duration of such Trials is over 15 years!!! For Example : Bevacizumab has been discovered in 80′s …we have it only NOW!!

    C- A new drug WILL PASS the trials if is effective in 10 % of the people and if it guarantee at least 2 months of more life… For example if they test 100 people with a drug and it is effective in only 10 it will PASS!!!! (they say : this drug is OK for more studies)

    D- It is demonstrated that in 5 Years, only 2 % of people are surviving due to Chemiotheraphy ( 1.500.000 People with all kind of tumors)

    E- If for some reason someone who discovered something that works ask to enter in a trial, he will be denied ,or he will lose founds….

    Don’t Know if Poly-MVA works or not (i’ve spoken personally with 2 Brain tumors survivors on the website) but FOR sure it’s very devastating when a doctor who has convincted you to use the RT + CT said : we did all that we can…go to home and die.
    What i don’t understand is tat they already Know before everything that such day will arrive…so they already know that RT+ CT are uneffective…

    Apologize for my english… as a good italian :)

  36. Judith Persin, RN said,

    You need to shut your mouth —as all it does is spew out lies and nonsense! You must certainly gain YOUR income from the big Pharma cancer Industry! Don’t tell me POLY-MVA does not work. It worked for me! I know others it has worked for and they have lived and are well. On the other hand, chemo and radiation have only been proved to fail. About 95 % of the people I know who have ever had chemo and radiation are now dead! And they did not last long. Anything with such a low success rate as chemo and radiation must be promoted by brainwashing and by preventing the truth to come out. That is exactly what the American Cancer Society does! Follow the money! If everyone finds out about that wonderful product called POLY-MVA –The American Cancer Society, big Pharma, and the conventional medical establishment would lose fortunes. If those three entities are so great where is the cure? Hidden! that is where. People are catching on. FINALLY!!!!

    a

  37. jdc325 said,

    “You need to shut your mouth —as all it does is spew out lies and nonsense! You must certainly gain YOUR income from the big Pharma cancer Industry”

    You seem to be rather angry Judith. You are also wrong. You can find my real name and competing interests here – you will note that I am not paid by Big Pharma.

  38. Edward Jackson said,

    I have had quite a few friends who have died from cancer and all but one went for chemo. All he did was meditate and he’s alive and well after almost ten years, so all POLLYMVA need do is be their mantra and it will have better results than chemo.

  39. Michelle said,

    I personally KNOW someone who had stage 4 breast cancer that had taken over most of her body, her conventional doctors told her to “get her affairs in order as soon as possible.” This was ten yrs ago, I`m happy and amazed to tell you she is alive and well. By doing the Gershon Diet and poly-mva. So yes I feel like people are just throwing opinions around and they have NO idea what they are talking about and also BASING in on WHAT? Geez, really if you know NOTHING about a subject why write about it and possibly turn someone off to something that could save thier lives? Do you really want that? I don`t ever really respond to these types of things but I just couldn`t stand it. And yes where is all the anger coming from? Anger and resentments CAUSE Cancer!

  40. Chantelle said,

    I don’t know whether I’m angry at the people here who are attempting to defend polyMVA with their anecdotal statements and righteous indignation or whether I pity them because they are clearly unable to think rationally and logically about the product.

    Before they get all up in my butt here, I do know what it means to have cancer because I have stage IV breast cancer. I did not cause my cancer and I am not responsible for having developed cancer. Anyone who suggests otherwise by saying that anger or resentment causes cancer is wrong.

    I do not doubt that there is anecdotal evidence that polyMVA has helped people. However, neither anecdotal evidence nor a patent on a drug is enough to convince me, the medical profession, or the FDA that the drug works. For all I know, a placebo given in place of the polyMVA could have benefited the people in each of these stories.

    Personally, I do not believe that polyMVA works to reverse or prevent cancer. Bolstering the immune system will not prevent or reverse cancer because cancer cells look like regular body cells to the immune system and so the immune system takes no action against them. “Improving” the immune system by taking polyMVA will not change the fact that the immune system doesn’t recognize or take action against cancer cells.

    I do believe that a healthy immune system is a good thing. However, I do not believe that polyMVA creates a healthy immune system because it is palladium-based. Our bodies do not need palladium to work.

    I think polyMVA is a snake oil scam and that people touting its benefits are doing those of us with cancer a disservice. Those of us with terminal cancer do not all need this kind of “hope”. We need to learn how to separate crap like this “treatment” from actual treatments from actual treatments. We need to learn how to objectively examine research and make decision based on actual clinical trial results instead of anecdotal evidence. We need to learn how to accept our own mortality and to enjoy and value the time we have left.

  41. the1seer said,

    Dear Deb O,
    Ignorance has no bounds. It really doesn’t matter what you say. Some people want to stay ignorant. There is no search for truth. They actually need 100 double-blind controlled studies from groups of people who don’t want to do the study to prove something works because their own sense of sight, reason, and common (or not-so-common) sense all fail them. It’s one thing to say we need to study long term effects and safety or HOW something works. It’s quite another to deny that something is working when there is no shortage of witnesses. One thing that never ceases to amaze me is when a natural or alternative treament works the diagnosis is questioned. And when it doesn’t work, it’s blamed. BUT, when certain approved treatments work, they’re praised, and when they don’t (which is most of the time btw), the disease is blamed.

  42. jdc325 said,

    Hi the1seer,

    Can you provide evidence for the assertions you’ve made?

    They actually need 100 double-blind controlled studies from groups of people who don’t want to do the study to prove something works because their own sense of sight, reason, and common (or not-so-common) sense all fail them.

    Who needs 100 double-blind controlled studies? Do they need to “recruit people who don’t want to do the study”? Who has said these things? Where have they said them? Links would be useful here.

    It’s one thing to say we need to study long term effects and safety or HOW something works. It’s quite another to deny that something is working when there is no shortage of witnesses.

    What makes you think that witness testimony (particularly in medicine) is accurate?* Who has “denied that something is working”, rather than simply asking for evidence that it is?

    One thing that never ceases to amaze me is when a natural or alternative treament works the diagnosis is questioned. And when it doesn’t work, it’s blamed. BUT, when certain approved treatments work, they’re praised, and when they don’t (which is most of the time btw), the disease is blamed.

    Who has done this? Where have they done this?

    *The perceived therapeutic effect covers: the specific effect of therapy; true placebo-effect; clinician-patient interaction; the natural history of the condition; regression towards the mean; social desirability (e.g., the desire to please the person treating you may make you more inclined to claim a treatment worked); concomittent therapies; other context effects. How do you think patients are able to distinguish between the specific effect of the therapy and the other effects mentioned?

  43. glassmirr said,

    For jdc
    The 100 or 1000 double-blind studies are demanded precisely by people like yourself. If 50 studies are done then 50 more are required. Anyone reading through these posts can see the weasel words you are using, most people have common sense. That’s why they are leaving your posts and using polymva.

    You claim there were only clinical trials using animal studies–many, many of the chemotherapy drugs (popularly) administered today don’t even have that!

    If you wanted to know about the polymva trials you’d be reading about them, instead of claiming they don’t exist.

    BY THE WAY, PEOPLE WHO PUT UP FALSE ARGUMENTS LIKE YOU SHOULD STAY AWAY FROM POLYMVA AND USE CHEMOTHERAPY INSTEAD. IT IS WHAT YOU REALLY DESERVE.

  44. glassmirr said,

    to Chantelle

    The palladium takes action against the cancer cells–READ THE BOOK!

    And I don’t need to tell you which book the elder scientist wrote because you already know so much about what bolsters the immune system.

    Even though, alas, it was based on your own ANECDOTAL evidence with your cancer. Does that count?

    Imagine, you were one of the lucky ones that benefited from chemotherapy’s placebo effect.

    You do know, 1 in 1,000 benefit (from chemotherapy). The others aren’t here to back you up because they are dead.

    The ability to comprehend what you read goes down after chemotherapy, look up it.

  45. seemorenine said,

    jdc

    By the way, do you have a study that you can cite with an author showing the results and methods in a chemotherapy clinical trial?

    Please post of of the shorter ones, as there are thousands upon thousands of them published in medical journals and no one wants to wade through them all.

    As someone who can’t be too careful, I assume you read some of these chemotherapy studies before you chose chemotherapy and believed the results they (chemotherapy) get.

    So would you post the evidence for that; for example like the 5 to 10 pages of a short chemotherapy study done on people (cancer victims)?

    And by the way, a two paragraph summary at the conclusion of a study does not count as posting the whole study, as you know.

    Post the evidence you already have. Someone that’s a stickler for evidence, such as yourself, wouldn’t be without a paper like that. That might be construed as skating on very thin ice.

  46. jdc325 said,

    @glassmirr,

    The 100 or 1000 double-blind studies are demanded precisely by people like yourself.

    Nowhere in any of my posts on PolyMVA have I demanded 100 or 1000 double-blind studies and I don’t know of anyone else who has done so. When the1seer made a similar claim, I asked who these people were that demanded 100 double-blind studies. the1seer failed to do so. Perhaps you would like to tell me who these people are?

    You claim there were only clinical trials using animal studies–many, many of the chemotherapy drugs (popularly) administered today don’t even have that!

    Please tell me which chemotherapy drugs administered today have no evidence to support their use.

    If you wanted to know about the polymva trials you’d be reading about them, instead of claiming they don’t exist.

    What PolyMVA trials? Please provide links to the papers that describe these trials.

    You do know, 1 in 1,000 benefit (from chemotherapy). The others aren’t here to back you up because they are dead.

    That’s an extraordinary claim. I’ve seen references before to chemotherapy only benefiting 2% of patients (debunked here) but have never seen a claim as wild as yours. Where does the 1 in 1000 figure come from?

  47. jdc325 said,

    @seemorenine

    By the way, do you have a study that you can cite with an author showing the results and methods in a chemotherapy clinical trial?

    Please post of of the shorter ones, as there are thousands upon thousands of them published in medical journals and no one wants to wade through them all.

    As someone who can’t be too careful, I assume you read some of these chemotherapy studies before you chose chemotherapy and believed the results they (chemotherapy) get.

    So would you post the evidence for that; for example like the 5 to 10 pages of a short chemotherapy study done on people (cancer victims)?

    And by the way, a two paragraph summary at the conclusion of a study does not count as posting the whole study, as you know.

    Post the evidence you already have. Someone that’s a stickler for evidence, such as yourself, wouldn’t be without a paper like that. That might be construed as skating on very thin ice.

    This blog post is not about the benefits of chemotherapy. My only reference to it is this complaint about the PolyMVA website: “The PolyMVA survivors website is advising cancer patients to ignore their oncologist, to refuse chemotherapy and/or radiotherapy and to choose an alternative cancer treatment instead.” I’m not recommending chemotherapy or radiotherapy – I am complaining about the website telling people to ignore their oncologist and shun evidence-based treatment in favour of an alternative cancer therapy that lacks evidence. I’m not “skating on thin ice” by not providing evidence in support of claims I haven’t made and if you genuinely think I am then I’m baffled as to how you came to that view. Why would I provide evidence to support claims I’m not making?

    If you want to read a paper on a chemotherapy clinical trial, I suggest you click here and select ‘clinical trial’ in the article types section in the left-hand sidebar rather than encouraging people to infringe copyright by copying and pasting such evidence.

  48. seemorenine said,

    I could bring you evidence from now till the cows come home and it still would not be enough evidence. Now instead of claiming you never said you needed 50+ studies and therefore don’t need to defend against it–now you’ll say you never mentioned cows!

    I read your latest post and you still have not answered the question,
    “Where is your clinical study that chemotherapy works?”

    You are posting questions regarding efficacy of Poly MVA, does it work, where is the evidence,… are you not? That begs the question, “What does work?” “Does chemotherapy work?” Do you have proof chemotherapy works? You, nor anyone else, has posted any proof that chemotherapy works.

    A few people have discussed their chemotherapy experience, but then, that is ANECDOTAL, is it not? By your standards, not worth anything. So once again, do you have clinical trial evidence of chemotherapy efficacy? One person, on this blog, talking about her chemotherapy results is not a clinical trial study. I mean you did complain that the Poly MVA testimonials by individuals do not constitute clinical trials. No scientific evidence, you were concerned. Well, you don’t have any evidence either by your standards.

    Patients that are going to their oncologists or going with a friend to an oncologist be sure to ask the oncologist for a xerox copy of the chemotherapy trial of the chemo drug he is using on you. I wonder how many cancer patients .went into that clinical trial, and how many appear at the end of it? Do you?

    I don’t think you’ll be getting the answer from jdc because he didn’t read any trials. He depends on anecdotes. He is covering that up by saying he can’t post clinical trials. And his latest hat trick is to say it’s “copyright infringement by copying and posting such evidence.” If you can’t post a chemotherapy clinical trial because it is copyright infringement, then it is also copyright infringement to post the clinical trial of Poly MVA. I wonder how an honest and careful person like jdc missed this point.

    I’m curious, have you posted on chemotherapy web sites asking them if they have properly designed tests showing a cure for cancer? Oh, I know you asked the Poly MVA survivors this questions about their testimony all in the interest of fairness of course. And that’s why I am asking you the same about chemotherapy.

    In your last paragraph I clicked on the link you provided to a clinical trial I had asked for in my post. After I got there, it was only a useless summary.
    What I said I didn’t need. You cannot provide evidence after all.

    I read a summary of a couple paragraphs. After I clicked on Clinical Trials on the left, I clicked on the 3rd study down from the top. It began with the title “Effect of Adjuvant Chemotherapy with fluorouracil…….” and I clicked on the title. It was not surprising to see the very dismal results summarized as …..
    ”RESULTS:
    Eighty-eight patients (61%) in the observation group, 83 (58%) in the fluorouracil plus folinic acid group, and 73 (52%) in the gemcitabine group died. In the observation group…”

    You could get half of the cancer patients to live just by chance alone. There are only 2 possible options here, either you live or your die. The fact that more than half of the patients died means this cancer drug is useless. 58% in the fluorouracil chemo therapy group died! To have a good drug you need more than half to be alive. That is the gold standard inside of the clinical trials that makes the results scientific. It’s no good to run several chemo trial groups when they all die.

    The whole chemotherapy trial need to be posted because more information could be seen, not just the summary or abstract.

    The results and methods are public information–that is how the scientific method is set up. Not to follow it, but to demand it of others just as jdc did
    I read your latest post and you still have not answered the question, “Where is your clinical study that chemotherapy works?”

    You are posting questions regarding efficacy of Poly MVA, does it work, and where is the evidence, are you not? That begs the question, “What does work?” “Does chemotherapy work?” Do you have proof chemotherapy works? You, nor anyone else, has posted any proof that chemotherapy works.

    A few people have discussed their chemotherapy experience, but then, that is ANECDOTAL, is it not? By your standards, not worth anything. So once again, do you have clinical trial evidence of chemotherapy efficacy? One person, on this blog, talking about her chemotherapy results is not a clinical trial study. I mean you did complain that the Poly MVA testimonials by individuals do not constitute clinical trials. No scientific evidence, you were concerned. Well, you don’t have any evidence either by your standards.

    Patients that are going to their oncologists or going with a friend to an oncologist be sure to ask the oncologist for a xerox copy of the chemotherapy trial of the chemo drug he is using on you. I wonder how many cancer patients go into the clinical trial, and how many appear at the end of it?

    I don’t think you’ll be getting it from jdc because he didn’t read any. And his latest hat trick is to say it’s “copyright infringement by copying and posting such evidence.” If you can’t post a chemotherapy clinical trial because it is copyright infringement, then it is also copyright infringement to post the clinical trial of Poly MVA. I wonder how an honest and careful person like dcj missed this point.

    I’m curious, have you posted on chemotherapy web sites asking them if they have properly designed tests showing a cure for cancer? Oh, I know you asked the Poly MVA survivors this questions about their testimony all in the interest of fairness of course. And that’s why I am asking you about chemotherapy.

    In your last paragraph I clicked on the link you provided to a clinical trial I had asked for in my post. After I got there, it was only a useless summary.
    What I said I didn’t need. You cannot provide evidence after all.

    I read the summary of a couple paragraphs. After I clicked on Clinical Trials on the left, I clicked on the 3rd study down from the top. It began with the title “Effect of Adjuvant Chemotherapy with fluorouracil…….” and I clicked on title. It was not surprising to see the very dismal results summarized as …..
    ”RESULTS:
    Eighty-eight patients (61%) in the observation group, 83 (58%) in the fluorouracil plus folinic acid group, and 73 (52%) in the gemcitabine group died. In the observation group…”

    You could get half of the cancer patients to live just by chance alone. There are only 2 possible options here, either you live or your die. The fact that more than half of the patients died means this cancer drug is useless. 58% in the fluorouracil chemo therapy group died! To have a good chemo drug you need more than half to be alive. That is the gold standard inside of the clinical trials that makes the results scientific. It’s no good to run several chemo trial groups when they all die.

    The whole chemotherapy trial need to be posted because more information could be seen, not just the summary or abstract.

    The results and methods are public information–that is how the scientific method is set up. Not to follow it, but to demand it of others just as jdc did of Poly MVA is jdc skating on thin ice.

  49. glassmirr said,

    ..jdc..wanted to know which chemotherapy drugs have not been tested–never HEARD OF ANY SUCH THING…..

    Eli Lilly from Indiana admitted to about $200 million in doctor payoffs for last year. Now they are passing laws to prevent this bribery. (Until they find another way around this too.)

    Doctors or oncologists can prescribe a drug or chemotherapy drug “off-label.” Do you know what that means? That means if they use a drug for one condition that has been tested, they can use that same drug for another condition without any clinical tests on people or animals at all!! The oncologist can do it at will. They can use drugs that haven’t been tested period.

    As a matter of fact Eli Lilly agreed to pay $1.4 BILLION to settle CRIMINAL and civil allegations of promoting drugs for UNAPPROVED USES. Unapproved means untested.

    Among other things you haven’t heard of is doing your own searching on the internet for things that are easily obtainable. Like the Eli Lilly information.

    Instead you continually demand proof for this and evidence for that while you don’t provide any evidence for what you imply in your questions.

    I don’t believe in a flat earth, but you mad fun of those who do by saying just because the majority believe it doesn’t mean it is a fact. The majority of people do not believe in a flat earth. But they do believe in chemotherapy like you. And you believe in it because the majority does, not because of some scientific proof.

    And the majority read anecdotes just like the Poly MVA people.

    I’d rather be a live anecdote from Poly MVA than one of your dead statistics from a fluorouracil chemo trial/group.

  50. glassmirr said,

    ..on a related note…

    John Corsine the former head of Goldman Sachs and MF Global was caught red handed, stealing. No one asked why he did it, they asked him where the $1.5 BILLION DOLLARS went. HE HAD NO EXPLAINATION. HE SAID “IT VAPORIZED!!”

    This is the method of operation for those in the Mafia Network–he isn’t made to suffer for it.

    When people run clinical trials on Alternative methods, like POly MVA ,and post them, those websites are taken down by FDA and others. No one at FDA is punished for it. A token person is fired once in a while but the FDA functions full force.

    Cures for cancer outside chemo/radiation are raided by FDA and their studies destroyed. If people post studies of such on the internet the FDA forbids linking the studies to the method or product(s). That’s why there aren’t any studies. And those who continually ask for more and more and more..evidence for your statements, know this. They are looking for web sites they overlooked so their buddies at the FDA can wipe those out too.

    You need to read it it books. Like “Questioning Chemotherapy” by Ralph Moss, PH.d. (www.amazon.com)You can find your cancer at the back and the drugs used to treat it along with life expectancy and side effects. The book is easy to read except for 3 to 5 pages. Not long. Also discusses clinical trials.

    Keep in mind in chemotherapy lingo, side effect also means death.

  51. jdc325 said,

    @seemorenine

    I could bring you evidence from now till the cows come home and it still would not be enough evidence.

    You keep complaining that no evidence you provide will be enough, yet you have failed to provide any evidence at all. Why won’t you post links to what published evidence there is regarding the efficacy of PolyMVA for cancer?

    I read your latest post and you still have not answered the question,
    “Where is your clinical study that chemotherapy works?”

    There are thousands of clinical trials of chemotherapy. They can be accessed via the link I provided earlier. It is effective for some types of cancer.

    I don’t think you’ll be getting the answer from jdc because he didn’t read any trials. He depends on anecdotes. He is covering that up by saying he can’t post clinical trials. And his latest hat trick is to say it’s “copyright infringement by copying and posting such evidence.” If you can’t post a chemotherapy clinical trial because it is copyright infringement, then it is also copyright infringement to post the clinical trial of Poly MVA. I wonder how an honest and careful person like jdc missed this point.

    You asked me to post the full text of a clinical trial (You wrote: “so would you post the evidence for that; for example like the 5 to 10 pages of a short chemotherapy study done on people (cancer victims)? And by the way, a two paragraph summary at the conclusion of a study does not count as posting the whole study, as you know”). This would infringe copyright. Posting a link to the full text would not. Feel free to post a link to the full text (or abstract) of a clinical trial into PolyMVA for cancer.

    I’m curious, have you posted on chemotherapy web sites asking them if they have properly designed tests showing a cure for cancer?

    No. Because I already know there are properly-designed tests regarding the efficacy of chemotherapy for various types of cancer – they’re indexed on Pubmed and some of them have the full text available without charge. Not only do they exist, but anyone can search for them on Pubmed and read them for themselves. Where are the papers describing properly-designed tests of PolyMVA for cancer?

    In your last paragraph I clicked on the link you provided to a clinical trial I had asked for in my post. After I got there, it was only a useless summary.
    What I said I didn’t need. You cannot provide evidence after all.

    I provided a link to a collection of clinical trials, not just one. You have clicked on one yourself and found only a summary. If you wish to read the full text of a clinical trial, simply click on “free full text available” in the left-hand sidebar. You have 13273 papers to choose from.

    You could get half of the cancer patients to live just by chance alone. There are only 2 possible options here, either you live or your die.

    No, you could not get half of cancer patients to live just by chance alone. The two possible options are not equally likely. Perhaps you might like to read up on probabilities and survival rates from the various types of cancer?

    The results and methods are public information–that is how the scientific method is set up. Not to follow it, but to demand it of others just as jdc did of Poly MVA is jdc skating on thin ice.

    No, that is incorrect. Some journals require an individual payment or a journal subscription in order to read full articles. This has nothing to do with the scientific method and everything to do with journals making money.

  52. jdc325 said,

    @glassmirr

    ..jdc..wanted to know which chemotherapy drugs have not been tested

    Yes, I did. You still haven’t named one.

  53. glassmirr said,

    Anyone interested in searching the internet for information on Alternative Medicine can sidestep being tracked and traced by evil Google every time you click on a web page by going to this web site and starting your search there:

    https://www.startpage.com

    It’s a free, private search engine that returns the same listings as Google.

    Startpage has its own servers and your IP address is not forwarded when Startpage connects with Google to finish your search. That way your IP address becomes unknown to Google, and also you will avoid those annoying pop up ads that are sent when you click on a ink.

  54. Chantelle said,

    @glassmirr

    Doctors or oncologists can prescribe a drug or chemotherapy drug “off-label.” Do you know what that means?

    Yes. It means that a treatment that is approved for use for one condition is being used for a something else – most often a similar condition. Because these treatments have already gone through the clinical trial process the risk to giving them someone is relatively small.

    The majority of people do not believe in a flat earth. But they do believe in chemotherapy like you. And you believe in it because the majority does, not because of some scientific proof.

    Your statement is incorrect. I believe that chemotherapy works because the treatments have been tested in clinical trials – in other words, I believe that chemotherapy works because of some scientific proof.

    @seemorenine

    You could get half of the cancer patients to live just by chance alone. There are only 2 possible options here, either you live or your die.

    This statement is incorrect, as jdc pointed out, because life and death are not equally likely outcomes. In cancerland, we talk about survival rates over different timeframes when discussing how long patients with a particular diagnosis stay alive. These are statistics, of course.

    The fact that more than half of the patients died means this cancer drug is useless. 58% in the fluorouracil chemo therapy group died! To have a good drug you need more than half to be alive. That is the gold standard inside of the clinical trials that makes the results scientific. It’s no good to run several chemo trial groups when they all die.

    This statement is also incorrect. With respect to the clinical trial to which you were referring, one conclusion was that “multivariable analysis adjusting for prognostic variables demonstrated a statistically significant survival benefit associated with adjuvant chemotherapy.” Therefore, in spite of the fact that many people in the study died, more would have died without the chemotherapy.

    When dealing with cancer, the gold standard is NOT whether more than half are alive at the end of the trial; it’s whether the treatment being tested provides measurable benefits to the patient. The Wikipedia page on clinical trials offers good information on the types of trials their phases.

  55. dingo199 said,

    So, let me get this straight….. there are around half a million peer-reviewed research articles on PubMed for cancer chemotherapy research studies, but no-one on the polymva team here can provide a link to a published peer-reviewed research trial on the efficacy of polymva? Not even one?

    Come on, you guys can do better than that surely?

  56. dingo199 said,

    Just to add – I mean clinical efficacy studies, not some report from Garnett about how some cancer cells were lysed in a petri dish by chemical exposure (you can get any cell to die on exposure to almost anything in the lab).

  57. Rob said,

    I have come across doctors who lie through their as……..oles. And the American Cancer Society lies like they are getting paid for lying. They advertise, if a person lives 5 years after their burn, cut and posion treatments, they are cured. Yes I said cured even if the person passes in 5 years one month. They truly are for the big pharmas and not for people. It’s all about the money to them. The American way, no?

  58. Deb said,

    Save your breath folks!..Jdc is well programmed by those who are pro’s at presenting what they want the public to ‘believe’….Don’t be too hard on him it is NOT his fault…Eventually the truth will come out and ALL will know that the documented trials and stats were created to convince the ignorant for the purpose of making $$$..It is a medical illusion, one of the Greatest Shows on Earth….Let jdc believe what he wants, it’s his choice…I am very proud of the rest of you for waking up to truth and sharing the ‘truth’…You instinctively know that you can trust those who post a positive personal experience….That is worth more than any paperwork posing as truth…In the future, the cancer industry will be exposed for what it is…

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